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Post by Marx-93 on Apr 1, 2016 12:18:25 GMT -8
On missile/rocket upgrades: I note that you have put no upgrades into any of these on any unit and would urge that you consider getting some. A little surprised that Marx didn't strongly lobby for it Missiles and rockets are great for burst damage and therefore reducing incoming turn 1 damage, but their use needs to be coupled well with use of Flak Off/Disable to achieve the desired effect. Open with kinetics first to reduce armor on units with high armor. Every missile gets armor deducted from its damage. Use missiles with higher damage first to reduce total enemy armor mitigation. I've kinda given up on super-specific cases like this one emoticon_ava_small . I mean, on general strategies, I'm all for it and Graph has again shown us that the more extreme missile/rocket build continues being very viable on hard even in Liberation day, but on super-specific cases where I can see from the upgrades that he probably hasn't touched his missiles much I'll kindly shut up . Missile play just requires a fairly different way of playing; due to all the multiple calculations and steps you'll need (you'll want to fire your missiles in bursts which means at least 3-4 attacks, all of them with amour, flak and HP management to optimize them) you're basically playing 10 movements ahead; the potential for enormous damage is there, but for that you'll need to see through to all the planning and decide it's worth it more than usual play (and due to being consumables, some of the first instincts are "never use!"). For most beta testers this sounds normal, but for people who don't take the combat system that seriously they may prefer to go without it.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 31, 2016 12:51:56 GMT -8
I tend to save often, but I don't really "redo" shots... what I admit is that sometimes when I have a hit of like 66% I just save and think "if I hit, I continue, if not I'll load and go with my other strategy".
More than one time however I've "reshot" simply due to my rage at when Assault decided it hastes me; it's the kinda silly thing that you're just doing it against a mook or Elite, and is nothing really notable, but the sheer misfortune makes me rage against the RNG and try again and again I may or may have not sometimes spend 10 minutes just raging against it.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 31, 2016 0:57:25 GMT -8
...I'm just going to put some link here and there to make the discussion more interesting. In all cases, the original Sunrider had a big number of owners because it appealed to a lot of different markets; with a price tag now however things get uglier and Samu-kun must simply decide what to prioritize.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 31, 2016 0:46:56 GMT -8
It will be pretty hard; the mission is fairly long and in Space whale mode just a pair of unlucky shots can be enough to make that. I think you can move forward; juts a little more for the final boss!
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 30, 2016 10:58:35 GMT -8
Blackhead explained my point better than I could. Simply, MoA was free, Academy was not yet a lot of more people were disposed to pay for it a lot more than they ever did for Liberation Day.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 30, 2016 0:14:40 GMT -8
OK, so I updated the graphics driver (it didn't give me as many problems this time) and switched the graphics renderer to DirectX. The play lag is still pretty bad. It might be improved, but it's hard to tell without a longer play experience. One notable improvement is that the videos of the Vanguard are showing now...before all I got was a black screen while the audio track played. So maybe that's actually better. I also started watching the memory usage on Task Manager while I played, and the more RAM option might be something to explore. While running the game, I'm getting roughly 80% memory usage. Even now, with just some webpages and Steam open, I'm getting 66%. While running, Liberation Day was taking up somewhere between 300m and 570m, depending on what was on the screen. More normal numbers were 470-530. If memory is really the problem, though, it makes me wonder why I didn't have problems before now. I play games that I assume would be substantially more aggressive in memory usage on a regular basis. Large memory usage is not strange; renpy from the beginning is not optimized towards that, and Sunrider's combat system is basically build through lots of Renpy layers and memory-unfriendly ways; it actually has larger requirements than some other similar games simply due to the engine they're using. However, it does feel strange to have such high percentages, even without playing it . In my case it runs almost perfectly (the worst lag is always when saving/loading) at those values you say but with only taking 66% of the total. What's your graphic card? There can be always some weird things with them.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 29, 2016 23:57:49 GMT -8
Wait, was the lesson that the developers learned "Include more H-scenes"? Alright, checked the Patreon and that looks like it was the lesson they took. "It's still too early to say anything concrete but we are going to make a game with not as much game play and more HCGs. I hope it'll also be much longer than Liberation Day, I'm hoping we can make a game longer than Sunrider Academy this time." For the love of god please reassess that lesson. People want choices, they weren't upset by a lack of HCGs. They want actual romance routes. Is there hurt feelings amongst the developers? Do they think that people are ignoring their carefully constructed battle system? Do they think that people just want HCGs and they are going to bow to the lowest common denominator? I think people want a mix of a good battle system and an engaging story where your choices matter. Like, you decide if you trust a character or not. You decide if Kayto is attracted to someone or not. Of course there are plot events that happen no matter what but the choices and views that Kayto can have or hold should be up to the player. Eh, Samu-kun has always said that he believes the fuel to more sales in Steam and everywhere for Visual Novels is sex... and he's not actually that wrong, looking at the market (unless you have a previous anime adaptation). Samu-kun has tried to do what he wanted, he got a big flop and basically criticism from everywhere, so now he's probably going to try what the market has showed it wants (which now is that they want Academy 10 times more than Liberation Day) to minimize risks. I mean, I don't agree either, but from the point of view of a game developer it's a reasonable reaction.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 29, 2016 1:15:52 GMT -8
I'm running the game on a processor half as potent, with 4GB of Ram and Windows 7 (32 bits), yet I have none of these problems, so it might be related more with the graphic card or rendering (also, as a misc advise, having such a powerful CPU and windows 10 with only 4GB of RAM is a bit of a waste).
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 27, 2016 2:34:51 GMT -8
Mostly what Vaen said, but I don't think Chigara has anything remotely similar to a Yamato Nadeshiko; a plain deredere with a bit of a dash of dandere (while not to crippling levels she's very shy and fairly antisocial).
And well, Sola is not exactly a kuudere (she totally is a Rei Ayanami expy though), but as Vaen says, arguments over what exactly a kuudere is or not are endless, so let's leave it like that for now.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 27, 2016 2:25:40 GMT -8
They would come in high numbers, I'd rather not have even higher numbers of enemies I also don't think a cheap unit to just throw at us would fit Kushaana. Unlike the other PACT commanders she doesn't seem like the kind of person to use zerg-tactics and sacrifice her people. Actually, I see it as very fitting. Remember that while with low HP, the destroyers are actually middle ranged and should be always in the cover of shields and flaks; they are not just smaller fast Cruisers, but hit&run small units that can attacks you from where you can't attack them due to their high EV.
Them being cheap is just a product of them being her main unit in the Compact revolution, when Compact couldn't afford much and had very few resources, not of being zerg-rush units (with hit&run I actually wanted to mean the opposite of that).
And well, them coming in high numbers also helps the balance; with high numbers you can't simply concentrate all your SHD Jam and Shut Off to make them totally vulnerable, while at the same time being able to destroy some of them and so not being hit full force.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 26, 2016 5:16:21 GMT -8
Hum, in general, while there are some deficiencies, I think that part of it is more simply due to uninspired design and repetitive missions that pure unbalance regarding enemies. I think that "heavy destroyers" feel a tad forced , though some kind of area/short-range weapon could help a lot; remember the mission against the Legion? if the Sunrider can have something like the Vanguard Cannon then even "regular Dreadnoughts" can also have similar weapons; I really like the idea of a "Dreadnought" regular ship that could act as a flagship in battles with tons of HP, weapons, and even the ability to give orders (or auras, like Drath proposed time ago)
On the combat Cruiser, the idea is nice in itself, but I feel that the main problem it solves is kinda more due to bad design level than simply something anyone else can do (and railguns anyway are associated with the Machiavelli's supercannon, so we can simply call them kinetics). If for example Assault Cruisers appeared together with normal PACT Cruisers in similar numbers things could change a lot: they'll be shielded against laser, and if you focused your kinetics on the PACT standard Cruisers you won't be able to focus them on the Battleships and Assault Carriers on the rear.
Of course, an upgraded PACT Cruiser would also make sense; the old one was always an outdated ship, and with Fontana as the leader it would make sense for him to try to refit them to something closer to his Fast cruisers. Still, I think they're generally fairly good as support (which kinda was supposed to be their original role in big battles); they're just no good at dealing damage, but as escorts for more dangerous stuff they do fine.
I like the idea of multiple attack low power kinetics (like the ones in the Black Jack) very much though, but I personally would feel it more on smaller Destroyers. Heck, thinking on how Kuushana seemingly used Destroyer in her big battles (and I doubt it was only the torpedo kind) it could even be her defining unit: they would basically be low HP (500-600), 10 armour, high EV (15), high mobility (20 EN move cost) and have a low energy (40) multiple hit kinetic (3x100, or maybe 4x75).
They would come in high numbers, and would basically accompany every PACT capital ship, hitting at you from mid-ranges while wildly moving around (they could even implement hit&run tactics of the "move one grid, attack, then return to my original position). Perfect target for lasers when they're not shielded, but most of the times they would stick around capital ships using their multiple hit kinetic to simply pepper you with annoying shells that slowly rise your attrition and repair cost.
For the rest, a PACT sniping unit is something demanded since MoA, though it would likely also be very hard to balance, and more varied objectives are also very needed. And I'm all for smaller battles; one of my main previous critiques is that there are too many "big battles", and as they are too similar they end being simply repetitive instead of punctuating climaxes like they should (of course, the writing also helps a lot with that, but that's for another thread).
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 26, 2016 4:05:49 GMT -8
I agree mostly with Ardanis. No need to drop laser upgrades, they can be very helpful, but the hull plating seems very excessive on most Ryders and the Sunrider. The shield power upgrades are not bad per se, but already having range 2 in both shields you can probably drop the power of one to get some money; with 75% SHD already the A.I. will simply stop shooting lasers at you. The upgrades on the Liberty and Bianca also feel a waste; any turn they spend shooting is a turn they lose. With this you can easily scrounge 3000+$ to get double shot Seraphim. To be honest, more than Double-repair Liberty, which I never used, I feel inverting on making the Phoenix decent (more EN) and preparing for 3-hit Paladin is the best if you have leftover money, though that depends on your strategy. If you're more defensive then surely double repair will help you.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 24, 2016 1:50:26 GMT -8
...You realize all this was to point out that Samu's statements of most of the players going through the game in waifu mode was false, do you? It's even in the TLDR in my first post...I only talked about bad reviews in one or two times in pointing that the longer the time passed after the initial batch of reviews 10-12 hours after the fact, the more the reviews improved, indicating a small correlation between time spent playing the game and general reception; which is normal, as you will enjoy the game for more things if you enjoy the gameplay, duh (and of course you don't talk about story length in a normal game as a its real length; do you know anyone saying "Ugh, Skyrim is so short"?). And then, that some of the initial problems (short-length for example, which as I said before was the one criticized most consistently in those reviews) will then be biased by that, as a normal consequence.
All in all, I just won't bother anymore; the fact that you're assuming that a group of people going through the game in a total of 9 hours of playing can contribute to the reviews 12 hours after release just as the same as a group that goes through it in 4 hours tells everything. The focus was never on writing, so for you it will be a "non-consequence", but rather wanting to address some kind of misunderstanding the devs might have had about their audience.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 23, 2016 2:21:27 GMT -8
Just throwing my own tidbit in, but I think it was more they didn't feel the story was worth the battles; In Captain mode or higher, you tend to put a lot of emotional investment in the story-payoff being worth the hell you went through to win the tougher battles. Anything lower then Ensign is people seeing if the story is worth it without the strain of investment caused by the latter. Short version - I'm of the opinion that the people who complained the loudest was largely because of their opinion of the story and not the gameplay, but NOT that gameplay was ignored; rather I think that playing on higher difficulties probably made it sting worse when they felt the plot failed to make it feel worth the effort ( Then again, I admit this might be a biased opinion since it's practically my own experience; my first playthrough was on Captain and... well, my initial thoughts at the time are a dead horse that's been very, very well beaten by this point, ^_^; Suffice to say I didn't think the good gameplay alone was enough). Point being... you're really just arguing semantics, I think - good gameplay needs a good story to serve as the payoff for the hard work you put into it, otherwise it'll probably just piss people off worse. It's been brought up before, but that was Mass Effect 3's big mistake for many as well; if something as big as the story fails, the point's moot. And TBH, I really don't think the first reviews were just "waifu-runners" - I beat the game in 7-9 hours the day it came out (stayed up and played from 6:00 PM to around 3:00 AM straight, minus bathroom breaks and dinner-time), on Captain difficulty. I personally don't think it's fair to say the first players were only interested in the VN or that the average player uses Ensign Mode; that speaks more to casual players coming later as opposed to the diehard-fans who would be first in line to play. It might simply be that Sunrider was lucky enough to have players who were that devoted, you know (again, possible bias here since I'd be one of those after-mentioned devotees and am using my own playtime as a benchmark to judge ). I don't think we're really arguing about semantics when some people actively shun the gameplay element. Neither I'm trying to talk about reception depending on them playing it on Captain or not, though there's definitely a correlation. The main point was that the initial reception and reactions were highly biased by the "waifu-runners", and that's a fact, not something you can really argue: -The rating and reviews started hitting by 9-10 hours after release; while this gives time to some passionate fans like you to make a run in Captain, I think we can agree the percentage of this is statistically insignificant, because it requires non-stop playing in very differing timezones. I'm not saying that there weren't people who played in Captain in them, but that in those first hours there was a high bias towards those that finished earlier because of being in waifu mode; in all cases, we're talking about the first hours of the game so the divide between "casual" and "hardcore" does not even enter the divide. Taking 2 "days" to finish the game still enters as a "hardcore" fan, just in a harder difficulty that makes battles longer; and likewise decrying people who play in waifu mode as all casual is ignoring that a lot of people were fans of VNs and Academy and followed Sunrider because of that -All the reviews considered as "most helpful" in Steam in the first days had the main point against the game being its shortness. All decried different decisions, but to the point to which they offered more consensus was the game "lasting 4 hours" (even more than decry against the ending and with only decry against railroading Chigara being somewhat comparable). This obviously points to at least casual difficulty selection, if not lower. And the average player is certainly ensign; not only has numbers been offered that at most 20% of the players plays on Captain or higher, but it's even the default difficulty. To be honest, I agree on most of what you say about combining story and gameplay, but dude, facts are facts. The entire point of the post was to make clear that Samu-kun's idea of "most players playing on waifu mode and going through the battle at top speed" is actually false, and due to a bias in the most initial reviews of the game just after the release. Now, that even players on Captain or higher criticize the writing or some decisions it's obvious, but at least they won't claim that the game does indeed lasts less than 5 hours.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 15:02:00 GMT -8
Hum, double shot Sola is certainly a priority, but triple hit Kryska is not necessary in my experience. Now, however, I went by using the Union Frigates a lot (all 4 of them); combined with double laser BlackJack that can be a surprisingly powerful combination, specially in 7.2.
A healthy use of missiles may help too, though for that you would require some previous upgrades.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 11:25:14 GMT -8
Sadly I'm so far not sure if the dialogue choices you pick really matter - in that regard it felt pretty "kinetic", but maybe I'm wrong. I need to see this through and will probably update later. It's kinda of a kinetic novel. Getting the "correct" answers nets you extra scenes at the end of the month but doesn't really change the plot or future scenes, I think. It's something fairly common in most Liarsoft games (or at least, Gahkthun had it too).
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 11:20:34 GMT -8
What I'm trying to convey here is that turn based component is likely to be under appreciated based on the data from reviews, achievements, sales. To be honest, that's actually as someone can expect from the context of the game. It's a game made by a developer called "Love in Space" with famous VN publisher "Sekai project" and advertising anime art style and Japanese voiceover (despite being originally English). I mean, imagine for example Dark Souls but with a group of schoolgirls, skimpy outfits instead of armours, a brighter palette, and made by Compile Heart. I can't imagine it would have sold well either... The way the game had basically 0 advertising beyond "having waifus" didn't help; none of the trailers had even a speck of gameplay, and as someone who tends to follow up to dozens of currents JRPGs, I can assure you most of us have this as a pretty big "not good" prospect. It has been quite a while since MoA too, so most people have probably already forgot about it, specially if they had 0 interest in Academy. And the price doesn't help either. I mean, for example, Drath , if you had found the original MoA for 20$ would you have paid it? Specially with the mixed reviews this is having? On other matters, the market audience of this game is originally very low from the beginning. Most games of the type really need prices around 10$ to really have tons of owners, because with the original niche market you simply won't reach it. Even monsters like Grisaia and Clannad, with entire franchises and anime adaptations build around them, general praise for both writing and technical aspects, having each a length of 50+ hours and a ginormous Kickstarter each still haven't reached the 20k. The only way to really go above that is through sales. Academy had very big results due to a combination of factors including numerous sales, a lot of people remembering MoA and buying it because of that (wanting to support the devs) and even luck. Lib Day could really try targeting that audience, but as of now it's a little too alienated from them. I mean, I myself though that the combat part of the game was being shafted in the early development, and I was a beta tester! If I was confused, then imagine the MoA players who tried it because it was free and then found the developer going all VN with Academy and the earlier trailer. Heck, even the first screenshots amongst the ones found in the steam page have no gameplay. There really needs to be a gameplay video (like with MoA) to simply show what the game is; I can really imagine some people going "oh, it's the sequel of Sunrider, that free game. Man, the game was laggy as hell, but the gameplay had promise. Huh, the OP and the Art is improved... wait, no gameplay on the trailer? Oh, man, it's going to be like Academy, right? Yeah, mostly positive ratings, uah, the reviews say under 4 hours... Oh, well, a shame, but 20$ are kinda a lot too, I think I can get Valkyria Chronicles with that..."
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 9:34:40 GMT -8
Just to add to that. Global gameplay stats (achievements) are openly accessible on Steam. Finished complete game on Captain: 13,5% Finished complete game on Admiral: 2,4% Finished complete game on Space Whale: 1,8% Sadly there are no achievements for easier difficulties. I presume that a considerable amount of players didn't even play through the whole thing, hard to prove without any stats though. It would be great to have an achievement for every mode in the next game, but simply having one for finishing the game (regardless of mode) would already help out a great deal in these discussions. Oh, they were accessible? Tried during half an hour from my phone, but had no luck. Thanks Overall however, 13.5% is already relatively significant. From the previous data it appears roughly 65% of the players played during the last 2 weeks, and as that includes just before 2.0 went live, it's likely a good approximation of the percentage of "active players" who have finished the game (and thus went for 2.0); this translates to an overall 20% playing on captain or higher, which, while not as high as I hoped, continues being a decent chunk of the total. It's very likely ensign (as the default difficulty) has 40-50% of the players and a mix of casual and waifu have the rest.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 5:16:08 GMT -8
I'd ride a Gunboat and become a hero of the Space Force by surviving situations I have no business surviving. ... unknown pilot-kun? What are you doing here?!
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 5:13:44 GMT -8
Bumping this thread for some careful considerations about Liberation day (sorry for the double post) now that there has been some time and data. Let's look at the Steamspy page here. First, it counts around 2500 sales. However, that number is not likely very accurate; Steamspy numbers only get really accurate once you pass the threshold of 30.000, and before 5.000 sales it's only a very ballpark number. The big fluctuations also point to this. Liberation Day could have sold from 2000 to 3000 copies (and of course this also counts the KS backers and people from patreon; you have to take out around 1700 in the worst case). Now, on the interesting tidbits. The average playtime has a median of 7:40 hours, and even the mean (which in Steam tends to be very contaminated by people who still haven't played or only touched it for a while) is not that far off. Furthermore, there's likely contamination from beta-testers like me (I have, I think, around 5.5 hours?) who just didn't bother replaying and redid everything from a save of the previous beta. Even with 2.0 it seems very unlikely a Waifu mode player would have reached that playtime, or even someone playing on casual. We can thus affirm that, unlike what everyone started believing just after the release, that the average player of Sunrider plays on Ensign mode. While the chunk playing on Captain or higher is unknown for me, I suppose Samu-kun has the stats for the "Captain" achievement and thus knows the true number. In all cases, all points to it being a remarkably high percentage of the players. Furthermore, even the median and mean of the playtime of these last 2 weeks is significantly high (median of 7.02 hours). While the release of 2.00 can explain this, I find it unlikely that the bulk of people would entirely replay the game 3 days after it again in captain mode just to see the extra scenes: either they would use the same trick that I did, loading from a battle save, or they did a very quick playthrough skipping everything in waifu mode.
All of this is very significant, because it points towards a very high degree of bias on the initial reception: the first players only interested in the VN part made a very quick playthrough and thus reviewed the game first, clearly dominating over the one who played for the gameplay, that took their sweet time finishing (and thus took more time to make the review) Even the scores reflect this; even with 2.00 the change on ratings (and even the "most helpful" reviews) is pretty astounding. Thus, the initially very bad impression is more due to a bias in the type of players than the game's intrinsic worth. TLDR: The thought that this game's audience is mostly people who rushes through battles in waifu mode is pure bullshit. The earlier impression is due to a bias in the time they took to finish the game
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 4:24:39 GMT -8
Hum... I thought at least "simulation" had an excuse in the sense that VNs in Japan are called "simulation games" (yes, that's a thing), but it seems the old answer of "people just being dumb" is more accurate...
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 4:19:16 GMT -8
Probably a buffed Assault Carrier with missiles and lasers. No shield, but yes big and powerful flak coverage. Good double hit kinetics but not specially super good, the default ones work. Also, no need for a humongous HP. It would be mostly a command unit able to fight on all ranges and support any kind of attack: Basicaly a Sunrider with half the armour but very improved EV (and around only 2000 HP), and kinetics of an Assault Carrier. If I could, I would change the Vanguard Cannon for an slightly improved Alliance Railgun, but if not I wouldn't mind it overall scrapping it for an improve of EV and perhaps a small shield generator.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 22, 2016 4:01:02 GMT -8
Nice review. I would agree on a lot of things though I'm open to accept Chigara's railroading if it's important for future developments.
And honestly, I'm really the only one that felt that the battles music of Lib Day was a slight downgrade respect MoA? I mean, they were still very good, but the one they choose for most "normal battles" ("driving the top down" in 7.2 and "Danger" here) is probably my least favourite battle theme. The new one (I think is called "Hero of Justice"?) is a lot better, but still feel both are used way too much.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 21, 2016 12:10:57 GMT -8
Yeah, you're right. Sola's kill of the first Arcadius was cool though, so I gave her extra points.
But yeah, reminder that Fontana means business when he appears with a gun and is the only one to actively kill major characters with one!
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 21, 2016 10:18:42 GMT -8
(that sick headshot on Arcadius is proof he isn't a slacker in a fight). You forgot sneaking on two people and a kill bot and somehow sniping the intended target of 2 people hugging each other. Reminder that Fontana has killed more prototypes than anyone (except maybe Sola) else in the story.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 21, 2016 0:46:32 GMT -8
I suppose it's useful to position your opponents as prudes, but I don't think the sex itself was a problem for people. People romantically involved have sex, sure. The problem is them being romantically involved. If it's like this, okay. However, what I wanted to express is that people seemed to want the argue it as two different points, when I think it's juts a reflection of how rushed the relationship was. If you problem is with this later (or with the relationship existing at all), then perfect, your opinion is perfectly legitimate and I don't plan to try to convince you of the opposite.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 20, 2016 15:48:46 GMT -8
I don't mind dissenting opinions, nor I plan to really convince anyone, but on the concrete matter of sex;
We're talking about two adults above 20 years old (one of which with a reasonable amount of experience, and the other an specially engineered body with who knows what priorities) in an universe with barely religious influence and probably hundred of ways to fight both STDs and unwanted pregnancies. And while they went from kissing to sex in one week they knew each other for at least month, and you can probably even argue that their relationship was ambiguous since before the Legion. Ava and Kayto had their first kiss together just before having sex, of all things.
And really, it's kinda a given when in the previous situation scene they were already talking about kids and family. If you really want to slow down the whole relationship, no problem, everyone already said their point about it. However I find this fixation with sex a tad odd.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 20, 2016 2:50:09 GMT -8
I like how they are now (specially when they add extra details of the setting and lore), but the idea of a character quote to punctuate it does indeed seem interesting.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 20, 2016 2:47:27 GMT -8
Very nice discussion. All in all, my feelings are more on vaendryll's side, the extremely rushed romance did make sense even if it wasn't good per se. The proof for me is precisely how the Captain's relationship with Chigara shifted from going very slow to going very fast. In MoA and the beginning of Liberation day she was simply going for tea, helping the captain, etc. Even if she had feelings from months ago, it wasn't until kissing that things started picking up, and it was both because the captain desperately wanted to make a family and because Chigara allowed it in order to please him. If you take the "rushing" part then things start to fall apart as the romance starts being more similar to a normal and good one.
Of course, it could have been executed better, the reason and timing for sex was terrible (though a week after starting going out is definitely normal on most relationships of 20+ people, it's more that the situation definitely wasn't suitable and the exact motivations very shaky), etc. But, while I would have probably done the dialogue different, the feeling of a "rushed" and "too perfect" relationship is kinda the point. More development would have been better and make things make more sense as an "irrational and foolish love", but the pacing itself of the relation and the ultrasacharine words would probably have to stay.
Now, that does not mean it was not boring or bad; the mistake of Lib Day was not exactly this entire plot point, but relying only on this plot point. A plot point can be purposely bad in order to improve or set a future development, but what can't that game/book/VN/whatever expect is to focus exactly on that point. That's where Liberation Day's plot falls apart.
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Post by Marx-93 on Mar 20, 2016 1:49:54 GMT -8
Nice finish.
On mission 10, I basically agree on almost everything. In Captain is really quite easier; the Carrier is quite the scare, but the relatively low flak of Alliance units makes use of rockets feasible and really helps a lot. I really don't know how I would have done that mission without the MIRVS (well, I know how I would have done it, but it really would have required me sweating a lot and praying to the RNG).
And yeah, the boss was cool on Beta 12.4, but on here it's even more of a monster; quite fitting as the final boss. Still, it really counterattacks with melee? I remember Drath talking about he surrounded with Gunboats in 12.4, is that now not possible?
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